I put this in the comment box but it was too long. Couldn't shorten it as it's just too important. So, I entered it as a new article. It is in response to John's comment to my last article.
(John writes) The figure of 96% of the US population being avowed Christians, which seems to be implird by the Alliance, is problematic. Take a look at this site - an IMPARTIAL source of religious data which states that only 76% of the US population is Christian http://www.adherents.com/
(My response) Hummm, ok, so ONLY 76% of Americans are Christians. That means the 24% are something else. What? Here are some statistics from your IMPARTIAL source:
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Posted on 12/29/03 at 14:01:41 by
Bobbette Madonna
Category:
Answers To Comments
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Hi All,
This is a comment from someone who does not live in the home of the free and brave, but rather to north in the home of the strong and free.
One of the fundamental reasons why the United States of America is a true beacon of hope for the rest of the world is the separation of church, synagogue, mosque or temple from state.
I appreciate some may consider this separation gets carried to an extreme.
However, irrespective of your point of view, this separation is important for the continued vitality of the American democratic experiment.
At the same time, as the world comes closer together, with nation's economies becoming more intertwined through the benefits and pitfalls of freer trade, we can see a different world take shape.
The last time the great powers were at peace for any extended period of time (the Cold War merely being an extension of World War II) was prior to 1914.
This time as we begin to reorganize ourselves into ever greater trading blocks, the importance of individual nation states may diminish.
The example of Canada and the United States makes for an interesting study. While our economies are closely twinned due to the Free Trade Agreement, we have gone in distinctly different directions culturally.
From an economic perspective, within the trading blocks, supra national and local governments will become more important, while nation states continue to jealously guard their sovereign rights.
Perhaps the greatest change is the rise of the multi-national corporation. Prior to 1914 vast wealth was accumulated by individuals, but the wealth was primarily based within a countries borders.
Today, many multi national corporations are bigger and more powerful than nation states, while offering less real freedom, reducing legislatures in some cases to being mere referees.
At the same time, another great challenge are the "isms" - those who perceive only their way is the right way and violence is justified to achieve the "true way."
Interesting times indeed.
Cheers,
John
P.S. Happy New Year
John Glube
Toronto, Canada
Discover How Anyone Can Get More Buyers
http://www.learnsteps4profi...
Interesting debate on statistics, holidays and titles. I think the really important point here
is that America is a place of freedoms and religious beliefs is just one of them.
Modern Americans expend a lot of energy grouping themselves...
easterners,westerners...democrats,republicans...
christians,non-christians...yankees,confederates
...whites,blacks...rich,poor...ad nauseum....
Why is it so important to categorize everyone? Aren't we Americans...first and foremost?
Placing ourselves in one of these categories has only caused us strife, pain and even death...political wars, religious debates, hate crimes and
civil war.
I realize that being an American means something different to each of us, but
the common thread is our freedoms, helping each other and taking care of
our country. Expending energy by defending a "category" title or belief only minimizes the importance of what we really are....free Americans! Everything else is just a bunch of empty titles we create in an effort to categorize ourselves into groups...for what ultimate goal I cannot fathom.
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The following is in response to John who left a messgae below my article on the ACLU. Thanks John, I was hoping someone was reading ;-). John's comments are in italics and bold. The rest are my thoughts.
One of the reasons why America is such a great nation is because the founding fathers sorted out and agreed there would be a separation between State and Religion.
This is your e-zine and you have every right to publish as you please. But, to return to a time when we must invoke Christianity as our savior and insist America be a Christian nation would make America no different than the theocracy being run by the mullah's in Iran.
Hello John,
Our founding fathers said that the government must not START or CONDONE a religion. It did not say that some 225 years later people have the right to remove all Christianity from America. By remove I mean, deny them the right to exist as they have for 225 years.
The bold, arrogant movement that is permeating America is a deliberate agenda. There are so many religions in this country that hate Christians it won't be long until Christians will be eliminated from view. That is the agenda. Which religion will come to the top? Well, I have my opinion and it's not one that most of us over 50 citizens are going to like.
Those under 40 have been indoctrinated and those under 20 have been brainwashed in our inept school systems, far left professors, an immoral society - ie., Hollywood, porn acceptance, far left judges and the ACLU to name a few influences.
I'm not against anyone's rights here. I am simply stating my beliefs. I don't hate. I don't make judgments without lots of investigations. I say what I see. At 63 I've seen a lot.
Separation of church and state is a phrase that has been repeated so many times people believe it is IN the constitution. They don't know it's one of the interpitations of what IS in the constitution. For 225 odd years now people have gotten along fine with Christians. For the last 15 years or so the pace has quickened to "get rid" of Christianity. Those responsible think they are absolutely right. I believe they are absolutely wrong. Neither will change their minds. "Things" are coming down to right and wrong. No gray. We will all pick sides on the issues and few will change their minds. Talking about it is just that. Talking. Right will be right and wrong will be wrong and never will the two meet on common ground. We can do little to change the course of events that will soon take place. When? Well, it's closer than ever before...
If this is the case, why was not religion forbidden while the founding fathers were alive? They were God fearing men. They came to this country for religious freedom. Some will say the far right took over. Nonsense. One doesn't take over the hearts of man, just their lives. Now, those same 225 year old freedoms are being killed by those who want rid of Christ. Why? What's the motive? What about Christ scares the enemies of Him?
Do they seriously believe that by forcing Him from view, He will go away? Or is it that they know if they hide Him there is a better chance for society to be raised with no religion? What religion or cult do "they" intend to place at the top? Could it be Islam? Jewish? Buddhist? What? Do you know? Do you seriously think when Christianity is gone another won't raise to take it's place? Maybe it will be Satanism. That would be my guess. This society is closer to it than ever before.
You can rest easy on that one, John. Christianity is not THE religion of America. I'd be interested in who is forcing you to say Christ is your Savior. The Savior of a human being is a personal thing. It's not one for anyone to dictate. There are many religions here. There is nothing wrong with being a Christian if that is what someone wants to be, wouldn't you agree? People can be what ever they like here in America, right? There is enough room in America for those who started it, isn't there? Well, that is a matter of opinion and freedom of religion is changing fast. I don't have to go into who's responsible because most wouldn't believe it. They are stuck in their own beliefs, just as I am. We can discuss it. We can disagree or agree. It doesn't matter. What will be, will be. The tolerance the left teaches is only valid for those who believe as they do. If you don't your are a damn Christian. Well, the Romans believed that too and you know what happened to the Christians and we all know what happened to the Romans. What happens to America is still to be played out.
May your personal world be Christian free. Send them all to me. I love them.
Thanks for your message, John.
Posted on 11/17/03 at 23:59:07 by
Bobbette Madonna
Category:
Answers To Comments
-
Hi All,
This is very simple. It is not a matter of State vs. Church, it is a matter of Satan vs. Jesus.
Our country WAS born of Christian beliefs, just check out early American history, even 50 years ago.
We, as Christians, don't push our beliefs on anyone, so what is the big deal? Why are so many Americans so bent on getting rid of Christianity? We are not pushing to get rid of other faiths. What is everyone so afraid of?
Again, very simple. Get God out of America's lives and we can continue to do what we want. To do things our way. We don't have to be responsible for the laws of God. We won't have to depend on anyone but ourselves, making our own rules as we go, justifing them by what science and man determine rather than by what God determines.
It is such a sad day in America today. Our flag flies limp, our morals are down the tubes. But heck, that's OK, we'll just continue to do things our way. Can you tell the difference of doing things our way instead of God's way? Just look at America now!
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[Link to this item]
This is a comment from someone who does not live in the home of the free and brave, but rather to north in the home of the strong and free.
One of the fundamental reasons why the United States of America is a true beacon of hope for the rest of the world is the separation of church, synagogue, mosque or temple from state.
I appreciate some may consider this separation gets carried to an extreme.
However, irrespective of your point of view, this separation is important for the continued vitality of the American democratic experiment.
At the same time, as the world comes closer together, with nation's economies becoming more intertwined through the benefits and pitfalls of freer trade, we can see a different world take shape.
The last time the great powers were at peace for any extended period of time (the Cold War merely being an extension of World War II) was prior to 1914.
This time as we begin to reorganize ourselves into ever greater trading blocks, the importance of individual nation states may diminish.
The example of Canada and the United States makes for an interesting study. While our economies are closely twinned due to the Free Trade Agreement, we have gone in distinctly different directions culturally.
From an economic perspective, within the trading blocks, supra national and local governments will become more important, while nation states continue to jealously guard their sovereign rights.
Perhaps the greatest change is the rise of the multi-national corporation. Prior to 1914 vast wealth was accumulated by individuals, but the wealth was primarily based within a countries borders.
Today, many multi national corporations are bigger and more powerful than nation states, while offering less real freedom, reducing legislatures in some cases to being mere referees.
At the same time, another great challenge are the "isms" - those who perceive only their way is the right way and violence is justified to achieve the "true way."
Interesting times indeed.
Cheers,
John
P.S. Happy New Year
John Glube
Toronto, Canada
Discover How Anyone Can Get More Buyers
http://www.learnsteps4profi...